maceme
Kitchen Assistent
Posts: 220
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Post by maceme on Sept 15, 2022 22:12:24 GMT 1
What about the mad hatters?
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smallgree
Chef
Here is a vial recipe:
Posts: 1,416
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Post by smallgree on Sept 16, 2022 3:24:49 GMT 1
What about them?
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smallgree
Chef
Here is a vial recipe:
Posts: 1,416
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Post by smallgree on Sept 26, 2022 20:26:58 GMT 1
This is recipe 09-25-2022. I've drawn up so many recipes that I've quit numbering them. I just date them. I do a recipe in phases. I don't change this, or change that within the same framework. I use different angles and theories, then adjust them in phases. Then I make decisions about whether I've gone down the wrong road or not. I'm on my final road now. I have three remaining theories. One is the Shelton theory. One is the vials theory. One is the "no one says CHS had the best recipe possible on God's Earth, so I'll make one better" theory. I'm sold on the theory that CHS discovered Aromat and adjusted his recipe to incorporate what it contained, mainly MSG, and umami enhancers. I also am sold on the remark about "multiples" which I discovered after I had already been doing the same when developing my own recipes. The vials were not a reflection of CHS's 11 spices and herbs, but a legal device to avoid conflicts of law and a way to "boost" the 11 "herbs and spices" persona. The vials not being numbered (after all "11" is important, as is "7") is telling. They are alphabetized, and the first two are darker than the others. They are like, and are both herbs. This is also telling. The light colors F and G are next to each other, and are the only like colors labeled in that manner. This means that the discovering of the light ingredients is a marker, as to a treasure. KFC hinted that there were 6 herbs, and the daughter hinted that there weren't many herbs in the recipe. Two views. This I call the 11+11 recipe. 11 H's and Ss, as given to Shelton, and the 11 vial Hs and Ss, which broke down the herb mix, and excluded the knowns such as msg, salt, white pepper, black pepper, and garlic. This is the riddle. I believe that, through his belligerence, CHS insisted that the recipe be given out in code (as he did) and if not done, Pete would have revealed it. CHS gave out hints, as he did to Gloria Pitzer. I've read that Claudia's chicken did not taste like KFC. It is said that it was very good, but only by a few. I have a chronological mind. I can't jump back and forth in time. I don't care what 99X is, or was. I want to know what the heck CHS and Pete did. After all, I only tasted KFC, after Pete was involved.
So here is the recipe, which I have not tried, but after I have, then I have variations waiting in the wings. This is a larger recipe, and I have increased the white and black pepper by one gram each, more than my formula dictates. It is done in multiples, and tastes much like onion, until it has rested awhile. Now it tastes like............chicken. LOL. This does not fit the vials.
Flour - 200g Salt - 30g Seasoning - 20g (the extra 2g of pepper to be added to the finished product. If you don't buy the extract angle, leave out the extra pepper.
11 spices and herbs (when I was young, salt was called a spice. An Okie thing I guess). These are kept in separate containers. Those grouped together should be kept together in separate containers, and ground together. I used mortar and pestle, and used a little salt from the salt container to help grind the ingredients. After the grinding, the containers should sit at least an hour, then mixed together to meld overnight. I grind everything except the white pepper (which I could not get from peppercorns due to unavailability). *The ginger powder and coriander are ground together.
The total recipe is 60% salt, and 40% seasoning. The percentages given for the ingredients, other than salt, are for the 40% seasonings, which is 20g for the recipe. Example: 20%x20g=4g.
Salt -------------------------------------- 30g
20% White pepper -------------------------- 5g (4+1)
20% Black pepper -------------------------- 5g (4+1) --- 10% Allspice -------------------------- 1g
20% *Ginger (& coriander) ----------------- 4g of ginger
13% Msg ----------------------------------- 2.6g --- 3% Garlic (granulated) ---------------- .6g --- 2% Onion (dehydrated) ----------------- .4g --- 2% Celery seed ------------------------ .4g
5% *Coriander ----------------------------- 1g
5% Italian Seasoning (grind to powder) ---- 1g _________________________________________________________________
20% White pepper 20% Black pepper 20% ginger 20% Umami (13% msg, 3% garlic, 2% onion, 2% celery seed) 20% Herbs and spices (10% allspice, 5% coriander, 5% Italian seasoning)
If you eliminate msg, black pepper, white pepper, salt, and garlic from the vials, then the vials would contain these, according to my recipe. Allspice, ginger, onion, celery seed, coriander, 6 herbs from the Italian Seasoning mix.
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Post by Silver on Sept 26, 2022 21:42:57 GMT 1
smallgree, please confirm if for you: Black Pepper, White Pepper, and Garlic do not count toward the 11.
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flg
Souschef
Posts: 1,578
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Post by flg on Sept 26, 2022 22:31:49 GMT 1
The one thing that caught my eye was the MSG listed at 2.6g. Most labeling I have seen MSG gets top billing sans salt combined recipe. Then it moves to the pepper. At minimum I believe MSG = White Pepper in weight. Not that I think this in any way breaks the recipe as posted. And thanks much for sharing.
I like the pepper at that level. My own personal recipe for 200g is 4g White, 3g Black. And I think I need more.
I like the Italian Seasoning call. As my tied for best recipe I used a commercial poultry seasoning mix @ 1.5g and it was fine. I really believe a nice balance herb mix is all that is required in that block. Italian Blend, Herbs de province or poultry seasoning.
Not sure if you have reached that much ginger yet. But that is heroic and I'd like to hear your feedback. I has thinking of trying 2g and that would fall short of what you may have tried. What was the ratio of coriander - Ginger for that 4g?
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maceme
Kitchen Assistent
Posts: 220
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Post by maceme on Sept 27, 2022 0:02:07 GMT 1
6g white, 3g black mixed, including lemon and 5g Ginger with .9g coriander and .75g sage seemed balanced to me recently. If there was a 20% herb, I am in the ginger camp, even if calling it a herb is questionable. I think MSG is a good candidate for 13%. It works out to about a cup for 400oz, and is more apt to be forgotten then a “regular” ingredient.
I need to get some new oil before I can pressure fry again to really test it. The Ginger boosts the pepper without becoming too gingery. It needed more clove and fennel or anise than what I added though. When I later added some chinese 5 spice in some gravy and then separately tried some David Wade dried Worcestershire powder on some eggs and they both boosted it in that area wonderfully. Planning to post a real recipe once the changes settle down and I can better compare it to the other fine tested recipes out there.
As I’ve mentioned to some, when you want more pepper taste for a given amount of flour, you can either add more pepper or add more mix. If you’re trying to maintain a balance, and also watching the percentages, it matters which you choose. If your recipe was perfect, and you add more pepper, you might never regain the balance. On the other hand, if you add more mix, you just increased every other spice which can have the undesirable effect of muting some of the best flavors and boosting others you don’t want as much of. And since the supporting herbs and spices affect the perceived taste of the pepper, it becomes quite complex. :-)
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Post by deepfriednew101 on Sept 27, 2022 15:10:34 GMT 1
I want to relay this Information which I have posted MANY TIMES.
CHS was in Canada and lived in Canada for 10 Years Plus, He was involved in the Missions and church plus fund raisers ETC. He attended many many events INCLUDING private functions and FAMILY events often.
In Personal Conversations HE said this MANY MANY MANY times
His Original chicken was ONLY Flour, Salt, Pepper He added the spices and herbs until he reached adding 11 Spices and herbs to his seasoned Flour (Flour, Salt, Pepper)
CHS measure then SALT AND PEPPER with a Tablespoon ALL OTHERS were with a teaspoon.
CHS said he started with the Spices and Herbs the Family liked and he added other from there.
when he spoke about Onion, Garlic, Celery, Parsley it was always in reference to FRESH not spice.
Mint was also a item he spoke about and adding it to his Drink
He complained we in Canada don't use enough seasoning and Canadian food was bland and not enough flavor.
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smallgree
Chef
Here is a vial recipe:
Posts: 1,416
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Post by smallgree on Sept 27, 2022 16:45:46 GMT 1
I see a lot of evidence for parsley, but have never used it. I just don't like parsley anywhere except in my tabouli. Many people use dried herbs that are best fresh, and not dried. Sweet basil, for example. Great fresh, but nothing when dried, especially in heat. Thai basil withstands heat better. If fresh herbs, and vegetables were used, then how did CHS package them in a seasoning mix? If he went dry, then when and how did it alter his recipe?
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smallgree
Chef
Here is a vial recipe:
Posts: 1,416
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Post by smallgree on Sept 29, 2022 21:54:24 GMT 1
The Vials, as of 09-29-22:
A - Thyme B - Savory C - Clove D - Marjoram E - Allspice F - Jamaican ginger G - Onion H - Celery I - Sage J - Coriander K - Oregano
Dressing and sausage.
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flg
Souschef
Posts: 1,578
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Post by flg on Sept 29, 2022 22:03:33 GMT 1
The Vials, as of 09-29-22: A - Thyme B - Savory C - Clove D - Marjoram E - Allspice F - Jamaican ginger G - Onion H - Celery I - Sage J - Coriander K - Oregano Dressing and sausage. So no red pepper and garlic is not counted in the 11?
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