Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2021 10:56:53 GMT 1
Quick thought. If you run a professional business where your recipe is THE most crucial thing in your entire undertaking, you cannot rely upon the continuity and quality of another business' spice blending. While it makes a lot of sense that CHS started with such, at some point he must have broken down the blend(s) to single ingredients. Maybe not for experimenting and adjusting, but definitely to secure his final recipe. No one would be that stupid, especially not a spice genius like CHS. This was the first thing I had to realise when I started thinking about opening a food business myself where a blend (curry) would have been a key factor. Blends vary significantly, and I would have subjected myself terribly by using any finished product.
A giant Corp like KFC would then take it to the next level by breaking down the single items, analysing the flavour contributing components and using extracts thereof for price reduction and qualtity maintanance.
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flg
Souschef
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Post by flg on Nov 1, 2021 13:13:08 GMT 1
Quick thought. If you run a professional business where your recipe is THE most crucial thing in your entire undertaking, you cannot rely upon the continuity and quality of another business' spice blending. While it makes a lot of sense that CHS started with such, at some point he must have broken down the blend(s) to single ingredients. Maybe not for experimenting and adjusting, but definitely to secure his final recipe. No one would be that stupid, especially not a spice genius like CHS. This was the first thing I had to realise when I started thinking about opening a food business myself where a blend (curry) would have been a key factor. Blends vary significantly, and I would have subjected myself terribly by using any finished product. A giant Corp like KFC would then take it to the next level by breaking down the single items, analysing the flavour contributing components and using extracts thereof for price reduction and qualtity maintanance.
I think there is a good possibility that the earliest recipe may have relied on a spice blend or 2 but as soon as he started down the road on franchising. That would have had to go for all the reasons you stated. As well as licensing arrangements and costs. It would have forced a reverse engineering of the blend into individual ingredients so you had control.
Now one could ask, was it 11 Herb and Spices early enough that that total included blends or was it 11 after any blend was reversed to individual ingredients? This would be an interesting find.
At some point I am going to go back around and look at the recipe I worked up based on Sexton's Poultry seasoning. Individually it can fit into 11. The one thing on that one is that the only recipe I can find for Sexton's is Lumpy's. And I don't know and we probably will never know how he got to that. I worry it was based on reversing it out of one of his KFC recipes.
The thing is common sense will solve this as much as science. You have to think about you being in that time in a modest type kitchen and building a recipe. Think about logically what happens when a business grows and as fast as this one did.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2021 15:13:50 GMT 1
I am inclined to believe that it must have been way before franchising even. I simply cannot believe CHS would have ordered 5 commercial units of poultry seasoning and 1 commercial unit of pumpkin spice, mix them together and still claim to have created a secret recipe. Not only would this make him a liar in some sense, but it would be less likely no one involved would ever notice, be it the spice company or anyone involved. Wouldn't people that helped him with the preparations remember if it was "just" a blend of 2 or 3 seasonings? On your quest for the note, you will get lost and distracted if you replace your 11 single spices with a few seasonings here and there, making it what 15 or 20+ herbs and spices? Honestly guys, this is not going to work. Our dear silver just hit the 20. Honestly, mate?  You notice .20 g of cloves amongst 19 other h&s in 600g of flour? Ever thought about Americas Next Talent? ^^ Keep it very, very simple. Take the most certain ones and get the ratios right first. This is your foundation. Less items, less confusion. You should not worry about the amount of salt, pepper, garlic, ginger or coriander after this stage. Once you have a solid base, you can try questionable items one by one and see if you have improved or not. Try to avoid too many background noises in your chicken orchestra. Every unnecessary addition to your recipe will weaken your foundation. |
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Post by deepfriednew101 on Nov 1, 2021 15:22:40 GMT 1
CHS was not afraid of licensing issues from others coming after him he was paranoid people would figure out his recipe.
The problem in the 1930's was supply and availability. It was hard to get supplies.
CHS has to drive 800 Miles round trips to just get the Hams he needed. CHS had issues getting spices also. Claudia was the one that mentioned many times that was her stress the running out of spices BUT CHS always knew what to do.
CHS always made sure he could use 1/2 of the spices he had and added other items to level out the change and then he could add the item he was OUT of as soon as he could get it.
you make a short term modification
remember there was a major time gap between the Original Chicken being made and great chicken being severed from 1939 to 1970ish Massey and Brown were FORCED to make changes because the Pepper shortage they faced first.
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Post by deepfriednew101 on Nov 1, 2021 15:25:34 GMT 1
Remember CHS said
YOU take certain spices from One and certain spices from another and you make a spice ? ? ?
so yes CHS was reverse engineering every spice other there
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Post by Silver on Nov 1, 2021 15:26:52 GMT 1
I still have my Recipe #4 to fall back upon. I believe this deliciously satisfying recipe gave me the most sensation of the 'note' (to date). Perhaps as much of it as required to be achieved/acquired. Post this recipe the goal for me has transitioned to exceeding KFC_OR. I.E., exceeding the 'note'. What harm is there in going beyond 11 ingredients whereby to pursue my quest? I'm not a professional in this industry. Just a retired guy having fun.  |
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Post by deepfriednew101 on Nov 1, 2021 15:44:33 GMT 1
is your total of spices 9.75g to 190g of flour am I correct with the MATH 5% of total between Spice and flour?
if my math is correct that's only 5% of the flour mix ?
LOOK AT CURRENT 2021 KFC mix ratio's
3LBS of Spices to 18Lbs of Flour 16% and people say its GOT very little Flavor.
if my math is correct with your amount ration you are under spiced ? I may be wrong but I have cooked to many LBS of chicken to know it takes spice to get Flavor to where People Really enjoy it, without Salt being the high point
ON MY WORSE day of cooking chicken we NEVER USE under a 18% spice to flour mix and Salt and MSG are ABOVE the MIX amount.
CHS threw 2 handfuls of MSG into the mix of 11 Herbs and spices in 1955 Lake Cumberland 500 Piece cooking order.
WHY IS EVERYONE SO AFFRAID TO PUT SPICE INTO THE FLOUR MIX AND FIND THE HIGHEST AMOUNT THEY SHOULD USE FOR SPICE AND HERBS
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2021 15:52:56 GMT 1
Silver,
add Garlic powder (not salt) to that recipe No 4, about 1,00 - 1,50 grams. Garlic is a natural flavour enhancer and the reason why we taste a dish many hours after we have eaten. You will notice how intense your breading will be when you coat your chicken before actually frying. We get the scent we remember from empty chicken buckets from grease and garlic, the first is the flavour and scent carrier and the latter the intensifier.
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Post by Silver on Nov 1, 2021 16:04:04 GMT 1
Silver, add Garlic powder (not salt) to that recipe No 4, about 1,00 - 1,50 grams. Garlic is a natural flavour enhancer and the reason why we taste a dish many hours after we have eaten. You will notice how intense your breading will be when you coat your chicken before actually frying. We get the scent we remember from empty chicken buckets from grease and garlic, the first is the flavour and scent carrier and the latter the intensifier. I just may need to revisit #4 with only the addition of garlic powder. Thanks for the suggestion!!! But 1.0 to 1.5 grams would make it the highest of the H&S in ingredient weight below White/Black Pepper. Are you confident that Garlic needs to be at this level? |
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Post by Silver on Nov 1, 2021 16:12:30 GMT 1
I've noticed that the 'note' diminishes overnight in the refrigerator for my recipes to a much higher degree than for KFC_OR. Might Garlic Powder offer benefit in this regard as well?
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You notice .20 g of cloves amongst 19 other h&s in 600g of flour? Ever thought about Americas Next Talent? ^^
