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Post by Silver on Apr 4, 2023 12:10:45 GMT 1
I'm initially liking the alternative version better, and very possibly with Lippia graveolens over conventional Sage due to Lg's broad flavor/aroma profile, but I could easily see where some zinging might help.
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Post by Silver on Apr 4, 2023 12:26:21 GMT 1
And lastly:
99-X Clone Proposal II, as scaled to 200 grams of flour
200 grams Pastry Flour 24 grams Flour Salt ------------------------ 2.5 grams MSG 2.5 grams Black Pepper (Medium Coarse) 2.5 grams White Pepper 2.5 grams Flour Salt 0.5 grams Mexican Sage/Oregano (Lippia graveolens) (1) 0.5 grams Coriander (2) 0.5 grams Allspice (3) 0.5 grams Ginger (4) 0.5 grams Dried Red Chili Pepper Flakes (5)
Sum = 12.5 grams below the dashed line
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Post by Silver on Apr 4, 2023 12:40:24 GMT 1
I could easily see zinging this 99-X clone attempt to 16 grams instead of 12.5, so: 200 grams Pastry Flour 24 grams Flour Salt (or up to ~30 grams max, per your personal preference*) ------------------------ 3.20 grams MSG 3.20 grams Black Pepper (Medium Coarse) 3.20 grams White Pepper 3.20 grams Flour Salt 0.64 grams Mexican Sage/Oregano (Lippia graveolens) (1) 0.64 grams Coriander (2) 0.64 grams Allspice (3) 0.64 grams Ginger (4) 0.64 grams Dried Red Chili Pepper Flakes (5) Sum = 16 grams below the dashed line
* I would probably add 28 grams of Flour Salt (instead of 24) for the initial attempt
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2023 12:49:22 GMT 1
Copied and pasted:
In the 1930s, when referring to "Mexican Oregano", it likely meant a plant called Lippia graveolens or "Mexican Marjoram", which is a member of the verbena family and is native to Mexico and Central America.
When referring to "Mexican Sage", it could mean a variety of plants, as the term is not specific. However, one possible plant that was commonly used in Mexican cuisine during that time is Salvia elegans or "Pineapple Sage."
Mediterranean oregano (Origanum vulgare) has been used in the United States since at least the late 1800s and was likely commonly used in the 1930s. When someone in the 1930s referred to "oregano" without any qualifiers, they were likely referring to Mediterranean oregano as it was and still is the most commonly used oregano variety in the United States.
Med. Oregano only after WW2?
While Mediterranean oregano has been used in the United States since at least the late 1800s, it is possible that its popularity increased after World War II. During the war, many American soldiers were stationed in the Mediterranean region, where they were exposed to the local cuisine and flavors, including Mediterranean oregano. This exposure may have contributed to an increased demand for Mediterranean oregano in the United States after the war. Additionally, the growth of Italian-American cuisine in the mid-20th century, which heavily features oregano as a key ingredient, may have also contributed to the popularity of Mediterranean oregano. However, it is important to note that Mediterranean oregano was still likely used in the United States before World War II, and its popularity may have varied depending on the region and local cuisine.
On a 1970s ingredient list, "Sage" would most likely refer to Salvia officinalis, commonly known as Common Sage or Garden Sage. This is the most commonly used variety of sage in Western cuisine, including in the United States.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2023 12:59:52 GMT 1
Another point to add: If Mediterranean Oregano was not used or popular before WW2, why call Lippia graveolens Mexican Oregano? Why name it after an herb that was not popular? Why name it Oregano when in fact it even isn't from that family? The only reasonable answer is, that average Oregano was in fact Mediterranean. And known. And somewhat popoluar. Then you discover Lippia graveolens, taste some similarity or same usage, and call it Mexican Oregano. So if the opposite was true, Americans would rather call Mediterranean Oregano Italian Lippia, not vice versa. But instead they referenced that Mexican herb to what they had already known and used.
Hope I am making sense.
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flg
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Post by flg on Apr 4, 2023 13:06:22 GMT 1
Per the Google:
Best substitute for Mexican OREGANO is Marjoram NOT Sage.
Let's bring some proof to the table that it is an OR ingredient!
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Post by Silver on Apr 4, 2023 13:09:35 GMT 1
Another point to add: If Mediterranean Oregano was not used or popular before WW2, why call Lippia graveolens Mexican Oregano? Why name it after an herb that was not popular? Why name it Oregano when in fact it even isn't from that family? The only reasonable answer is, that average Oregano was in fact Mediterranean. And known. And somewhat popoluar. Then you discover Lippia graveolens, taste some similarity or same usage, and call it Mexican Oregano. So if the opposite was true, Americans would rather call Mediterranean Oregano Italian Lippia, not vice versa. But instead they referenced that Mexican herb to what they had already known and used. Hope I am making sense. Perfect sense!
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Post by Silver on Apr 4, 2023 13:13:49 GMT 1
Per the Google: Best substitute for Mexican OREGANO is Marjoram NOT Sage. Let's bring some proof to the table that it is an OR ingredient! That would require @deepfiednew101 being straight forward with us as opposed to beating around the bush.
In all of my speculative 99-X clones above common Sage can be used instead Mexican Oregano.
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flg
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Post by flg on Apr 4, 2023 13:18:08 GMT 1
And while you COULD most likely substitute Mexican Oregano with Marjoram and some Coriander. It doesn't seem like a cost saving adventure.
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Post by Silver on Apr 4, 2023 13:30:08 GMT 1
In retrospect the "only post WW2" theory for oregano is absurd, as Italian and other Mediterranean region immigrants to NA go well back in time, and they would have brought their cuisines and spices along with them.
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