smallgree
Chef
Here is a vial recipe:
Posts: 1,417
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Post by smallgree on Jan 3, 2024 2:43:48 GMT 1
Clove has been greatly ignored, and understudied. Chickenman, please fill in the vials. If you can't, then you have no credibility. You can't just accept some, and ignore the rest. I'm not the village idiot.
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Post by Chickenman on Jan 3, 2024 2:55:28 GMT 1
Clove has been greatly ignored, and understudied. Chickenman, please fill in the vials. If you can't, then you have no credibility. You can't just accept some, and ignore the rest. I'm not the village idiot. How does filling in the vials prove credibility? there is no proof all of them are legit. I am entitled to my own opinion about them which is that some of them appear to be legit, but i know for fact the entire recipe will NOT fit into those vials. End of discussion. Show me how you fit mustard, celery seed, cinnamon, fenugreek etc in the vials individually? you can't, yet all those ARE in the recipe. You think his recipe only contains 3 herbs? really? yeah, no.
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maceme
Kitchen Assistent
Posts: 220
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Post by maceme on Jan 3, 2024 3:01:38 GMT 1
Clove has been greatly ignored, and understudied. Chickenman, please fill in the vials. If you can't, then you have no credibility. You can't just accept some, and ignore the rest. I'm not the village idiot. How does filling in the vials prove credibility? there is no proof all of them are legit. I am entitled to my own opinion about them which is that some of them appear to be legit, but i know for fact the entire recipe will NOT fit into those vials. End of discussion. Show me how you fit mustard, celery seed, cinnamon, fenugreek etc in the vials individually? you can't, yet all those ARE in the recipe. You think his recipe only contains 3 herbs? really? yeah, no. You can fit as many as there are… you just need to recognize multiple ingredients per vial.
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Post by Chickenman on Jan 3, 2024 3:05:47 GMT 1
How does filling in the vials prove credibility? there is no proof all of them are legit. I am entitled to my own opinion about them which is that some of them appear to be legit, but i know for fact the entire recipe will NOT fit into those vials. End of discussion. Show me how you fit mustard, celery seed, cinnamon, fenugreek etc in the vials individually? you can't, yet all those ARE in the recipe. You think his recipe only contains 3 herbs? really? yeah, no. You can fit as many as there are… you just need to recognize multiple ingredients per vial. Yes, and i have mentioned this which fits alot of my ingredients. I've stated that one of them has to be italian herbs, one an apple pie spice mix, one maybe a curry powder. Yet it still makes no sense because you can't use those mixes as they are because their proportions wouldn't be correct. Sage needs to be heavier in the recipe than the amount that would be in an Italian herbs mix.
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cman
Kitchen Assistent
Posts: 205
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Post by cman on Jan 3, 2024 3:10:37 GMT 1
Maceme, by using that logic, then the vials are nothing but a marketing ploy to publicize the 11 H & S.
With that strategy, then the public can further be convinced that KFC is wholesome.
On the other hand, the vials hold no merit in the actual recipe.
I still pose the question: why hasn’t there been a class action suit: albeit a nuisance lawsuit? Perhaps, 11 H & S has not been a claim but merely a slogan.
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maceme
Kitchen Assistent
Posts: 220
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Post by maceme on Jan 3, 2024 3:52:55 GMT 1
If you are going to sue, what is your standing? How were you injured? It is a marketing slogan. They don’t actually claim only 11 ingredients, just 11 secret. Even the Settle’s recipe was claimed short, and we don’t know how many recipes or blends it contains. I see the vials as having multiple uses. 11 was so heavily marketed by the corporation that if the actual recipe ingredients, (or a representation thereof) were to be put in vials, and stored in the cornerstone of the technical building as essentially a time capsule, anything other than 11 vials would cause unnecessary, visibly huge public problems. CHS hadn’t died when they were being developed, and I believe they were to be presented on his birthday, which would have been great marketing. As smallgree astutely pointed out, the vials were labeled with letters, not numbers. There are a few reasons why that might be useful, but one of them is that letters support multiple ingredients per vial. Some might have more than others, perhaps even hardly containing their contents. I will state here I commend the artistry involved with the vials creation, and my appreciation has grown tremendously over the past couple years. Anyone can feel free to direct message me if you come to fully agree with that statement and perhaps we can discuss their origin and subtleties. The whole concept of 11 is marketing, on some level, even if one can tortuously justify it somehow. Original Recipe etc. are trademarks for marketing. There is no claim to ingredient labeling involved, or that the actual, as first developed “Original Recipe” is in use by your local outlet. We know the recipe significantly varies by country, which tells you all you need to know about the current legitimacy of the recipe. Just hypothetically, if you have some surprisingly large number, say 50+ ingredients, perhaps you contort things using some combination of: 1) Count seasoning blends that consist of many, many ingredients as 1, and if you have to bump up an ingredient already in the blend, you don’t count it in your 11. 2) Don’t count seasoning blends at all - only refer to pure herbs and spices you added 3) Don’t count salt and pepper of any form, or other items traditionally called seasonings, or fruits, vegetables, roots, berries, adjuncts, leavenings, sweeteners etc. 4) Only count the “secret” 11 herbs and spices. Just count the ones that are unusual. Only count the ones not on everyone’s shelf - the ones people don’t think of often, or even know about. And then maybe the “secret ones” you use a separate company for, like Stange, or split the secret 11 across two companies, and sprinkle in the rest between them according to their specialties. Everything else isn’t counted in the marketing slogan number eleven Or maybe there really are only 11. I don’t think so, however…..
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smallgree
Chef
Here is a vial recipe:
Posts: 1,417
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Post by smallgree on Jan 3, 2024 4:36:25 GMT 1
I made this observation, years ago, about how the number "11" might have come about. CHS could have been on the tail end of a series of experiments, and finally hit the note he wanted. When he counted the packages of mixes, and bottles of individual elements before him, he counted 11.
I have a minimum of 4 blends that could have been used. When KFC went public, it had to adjust these blends to comply with copyright law. The spice companies employed, developed copycat blends, through trial and error, and the Corporate KFC OR resulted. CHS had a cat. This is a fact. This explains how the recipe went from a savory sweet like product, to a more salty product. Very similar, but not quite spot on. Many adjustments undoubtedly were made through the years, to the point of obscuring the original taste.
My reasoning to this is the introduction of MSG, which must have replaced the umami present in some of the commercial mixes. This is my story, and I'm sticking to it. There never were just 11 herbs and spices, and Chickenman has the right idea. You just catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.
I think the biggest hurdle that we all have faced is that story about CHS complaining about the lack of Jamaican ginger, and the alleged addition of so much more of it into the seasoning bags. That presumption is corroborated only by Ledington's recipe, and that Grace fiasco, which is boot strapping.
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cman
Kitchen Assistent
Posts: 205
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Post by cman on Jan 3, 2024 10:18:10 GMT 1
One more possibility of showing the vials is to avoid deceptive advertising if each vial contains multiple spices instead of just having one. All because 11 vials are shown. It is indeed a brilliant marketing campaign designed to both protect the company and also the sell the product. One could claim deceptive advertising and puffery if one is led to believe that the taste is achievable with only 11 herbs and spices. Humorously, perhaps one could claim harm if spending 10 or more years is claimed trying to achieve the taste of KFC OR all because of the slogan. Aside, following the experience of DFN101, filling void of the mix met with a degree of difficulty after removing the vegetables items from the list. By removing the vegetables, a claim of 11 herbs and spices is then made possible. hls.harvard.edu/today/harvard-law-expert-explains-the-burger-king-false-advertising-lawsuit/
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Post by deepfriednew101 on Jan 3, 2024 15:26:31 GMT 1
I find it Funny that So many have Bags of K.F.C. seasoning and when the other forum went to test 99x NO ONE supplies Original Seasoning to be compared to 99x.
IF ANY ONE Has samples of Spice from Other countries It can be Tested in Canada.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2024 15:58:41 GMT 1
I find it Funny that So many have Bags of K.F.C. seasoning and when the other forum went to test 99x NO ONE supplies Original Seasoning to be compared to 99x. IF ANY ONE Has samples of Spice from Other countries It can be Tested in Canada. I was personally looking for labs that would test them in Europe, no chance. They all told me they'd only do commercial scale analyses, not for private persons. And they would also say that the type of service I was asking for is not common and technically very difficult. It is not common practise to get seasonings analysed for ingredients. They usually test them for harmful substances or pollutants etc. You might have better chances in the US and Canada. No idea. But the corporate ingredients are no secret, so there is not much to be expected from such analyses anyway. I find it funny that you really doubt that people own KFC seasoning bags which are easy to obtain, but want us to believe you own a handwritten recipe without any proof What's the status BTW? It's been more than half a year since your document was sent out for the age verification if I'm not mistaken? Taking quite long.
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