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Post by jseo12 on Apr 13, 2021 5:50:30 GMT 1
You are overthinking. Just look at vials as well as other things. It's clear that white pepper and black pepper are parts of 11 herbs and spices. Colonel did not have complex views on classifying herbs and spices like FDA does. Generally, they are considered as spices. That's why it's important to look at variety of sources to come up with a valid conclusion. Perhaps, the original bag says "salt, garlic powder, msg, spices", not "11 herbs and spices".
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Post by DutchGuy on Apr 13, 2021 15:23:26 GMT 1
The 11 Herbs and Spices do not include Salt Pepper MSG, Garlic, Onion, Celery, So the Vials must then be 11 other Spice and Herbs and Tarragon was listed in the court case when the house recipe was disclosed Woh woh woh... Wait... What?! Slow down! Please, do explain... what's with the Tarragon? |
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Post by jseo12 on Apr 13, 2021 16:16:30 GMT 1
In the 90's the family who had bought Colonel Sanders private restaurant claimed that they'd found a diary in the basement of their house (which had belonged to Colonel Sanders)... and they said it contained a recipe of 11 herbs and spices, in Harland's handwriting. What did KFC Corp do? ... they immediately sued the family (the Settles), and had the diary confiscated. However, the diary recipe was found not to be a Colonel's original recipe.
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Post by DutchGuy on Apr 14, 2021 2:37:04 GMT 1
Ow... Ok thx!
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Post by halcoleman11 on Apr 14, 2021 7:25:00 GMT 1
In a court Case a defendant was using the stolen KFC recipe of 11 Herbs and Spices the court Bared the defendant from using a spice blend which contains more than 5 individual spices, in addition to salt pepper and MSG the court documents also disclosed that Tarragon was used in the chicken and Tarragon Flavored Vinegar was used in the coleslaw. It disclosed that the Salt, Pepper and MSG were not part of the 11 Herbs and Spices
In the Tommy and Cherry Settler case it says The Colonel’s recipe has 11 Herbs and Spices. This falls about five herbs and spices short? Both Tommy and Cherry claimed it was a Chicken recipe and they know what goes into chicken recipes. Both said it had 11 Herbs and Spices But could not speak about the other seasoning. KFC then Hired Tommy Settler to work for KFC and he was driving a new car? KFC dropped the lawsuit.
There are 6 other court cases where KFC either Lost or bought out the Defendants or forced changes to the recipe the Defendants were using. Marion Kay, Pats KFC Ireland, Colonel Sanders, and others. Glen and Friends did not do his homework when he said he read court cases? He would have know Salt, Pepper, MSG are not part of the 11 Herbs and Spices.
Glen did not comment on the reverse engineer documents in China, Russia, USA, Canada which all list possible items and he does not speak about the 1974 Esquire where the Top 4 chefs were asked to say what was in KFC.
1974 Esquire KFC investigation
Janes Beard Cayenne Pepper, Cinnamon, MSG
Roy Andries Rosemary, Savory, Tarragon, Thyme, Pepper, Turmeric, Cinnamon, Salt, MSG, Honey or Brown Sugar, Almond, Mint
Waverly Root Flour, Milk, Egg, Salt, Pepper, Celery Salt, Caraway, Chili Powder, Horseradish
James Vilas Cinnamon, Cloves, Sugar
simple break down from the above
Salt, Pepper, MSG, Sugar x 2, Flour, Milk, Egg,
Caraway, Cayenne Pepper, Celery Salt, Chili Powder Cinnamon x3, Cloves, Rosemary, Savory, Tarragon, Thyme, Turmeric,
I wonder how 3 of the 4 op chefs in 1974 eating original KFC say Cinnamon, and they were all asked independently what they tasted it was not completed sitting around a table so they did not speak to each other?
The reverse engineer test in China, Russia, and Canada, said Cinnamon
The reverse engineer on the Chicken from KFC shows brine with heavy MSG content, and other Spices and Herbs or Oils
All this information has been shown on the internet
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Post by DutchGuy on Apr 16, 2021 15:45:34 GMT 1
Glen did not comment on the reverse engineer documents in China, Russia, USA, Canada which all list possible items and he does not speak about the 1974 Esquire where the Top 4 chefs were asked to say what was in KFC. Where can we find these documents? |
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Post by halcoleman11 on Apr 17, 2021 6:31:13 GMT 1
1974 Esquire Article  the reverse engineer docs were on web sites and forums |
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Post by justme on Apr 18, 2021 4:43:04 GMT 1
Additional information that came to light since I originally wrote this piece is as follows. In 2011, a student at a Chinese University took a 100 gram sample of Original Recipe chicken and did an "Analysis of Volatile Compounds of KFC Original Recipe Fried Chicken by Simultaneous Distillation Extraction and Gas Chromatography-Mass Spectrometry". The result of the analysis were published in a paper written in Chinese. Another fellow KFC researcher with a background in chemistry was able to translate the document and summarize some of the data in the analysis and 100% confirm the existence of certain compounds found in some of the suspected, but previously unconfirmed ingredients. These ingredients are: Allspice, Cloves and Thyme. In addition to this information it was revealed that compounds from Chili Peppers which we knew to be in the recipe were indeed present, but that there was no appreciable capsaicin content present. Indicating that the Red Pepper is a very mild, lightly sweet variety, not hot. That was me. I am revisiting that chemical analysis after a long absence because I got bored with it and I had developed a recipe that I love based on it. Unfortunately, additional research into the decomposition/loss products of the herbs and spices during cooking is leading me to further question one of my 11 herbs and spices, which is very annoying (to me at least). That ingredient is Coriander. The complete absence of any sulfide compounds rules out garlic and onion, at least from that sample. That's not to say that it isn't used in other countries, or wasn't used in the past, but they definitely were not in that sample. I know garlic supposedly appeared on some label somewhere, but it wasn't in that sample. Nobody has ever explained the huge amount of nonanal in the sample, with its distinct orange flavor (it is an artifical orange flavoring). Although nonanal is the second largest decomposition compound from cooked ginger, it's not possible to achieve the level of nonanal in the sample unless it is added either as a chemical additive or from orange peel. Again, and I always say this, just because something was or was not in the sample, that doesn't mean it always was - or never has been - used in other countries or at other times in history. There is no guarantee that they use the same recipe everywhere in the world nor is there a guarantee that they haven't changed the recipe over the decades, and I think almost everyone agrees they have done that. One thing I can say for sure, the reduced time of pressure frying drastically reduces the amount of decomposition/loss of many of the key flavor compounds, and therefore people who are open frying and not pressure frying will need drastically more of those spices to get similar results. The extra, less volatile compounds that adds will always throw the flavors out of balance. I can even tell the difference in flavor if I go just one minute too long in the fryer. I currently pressure fry dark meat 8 minutes and white meat 7 minutes, and I think I'm overcooking it slightly. So get a Magefesa Star pressure cooker or a Wearever Chicken Bucket and pressure fry it. Note: I am NOT RESPONSIBLE for any safety issues you may encounter. Video here (although his chicken looks terrible): I have modified my Magefesa pressure cooker to increase the pressure from 8 pounds to 13 pounds, exactly that of the pressure fryers used by KFC and others using Henny Penny pressure fryers. No, I will not provide directions to do it. You need precise formulas and an Excel sheet to do the math, and I won't give that out either. You can research it online. |
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Post by justme on Apr 18, 2021 5:04:10 GMT 1
Glen did not comment on the reverse engineer documents in China, Russia, USA, Canada which all list possible items ... I have the chemical analysis from China and have spent weeks (now months) breaking it down using the individual chemical compounds. Where are the "reverse engineer documents" from Russia, USA, and Canada, and are they chemical analyses or chef guesses/copycats? The reverse engineer test in China, Russia, and Canada, said Cinnamon Not the one from China. The complete absence of cinnamaldehyde excludes both cinnamon and cassia bark from that sample. The reverse engineer on the Chicken from KFC shows brine with heavy MSG content, and other Spices and Herbs or Oils. Although I have little doubt that KFC currently brines in some form, I quit doing it because I pressure fry, and the extra water that brining sucks out of the chicken is a negative instead of a positive. Henny Penny pressure fryer manuals advise not to brine. In addition, brining PLUS the specified amount of salt per 25 pounds flour is way too salty. A fresh chicken 2-1/2 to 2-3/4 pounds as specified by the Colonel works perfectly with no brine, although I have to go to a special market to get ones that small and pay a premium price. They may now be using older, tougher chickens that need brining, and if so probably slightly reduced the salt in the seasoning to compensate. Chicken size reminds me of another point I have discovered. A chicken larger than 2-1/2 to 2-3/4 pounds as originally specified will have significantly less seasoning because it has relatively less coating. I have tried up to 3-1/4 pounds, and the reduction in seasoning is noticeable. |
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Post by jseo12 on May 17, 2021 14:54:20 GMT 1
All the vials are cracked. So what are the measurements of each spice?
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