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Post by Silver on Jan 22, 2024 17:31:41 GMT 1
I looked at Claudia's recipe again and realized for the first time that she cooked in a cast iron skillet. Her seasoning, made by Marion Kay, is similar in weight to 99X. Some said that her chicken did not taste the same as KFC. Maybe it is because it wasn't pressure fried. If you only looked at the cooking instructions, they would naturally refer to open kettle deep frying only.
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smallgree
Chef
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Post by smallgree on Jan 22, 2024 21:53:16 GMT 1
1/8th inch of oil in a skillet is not open kettle deep frying.
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smallgree
Chef
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Post by smallgree on Jan 23, 2024 3:57:11 GMT 1
I'm a fellow who loves black and white pepper. I overuse it in about everything I cook, or prepare. Didn't think much about it, but I was sitting around and thought about the post that suggested that too much white pepper had a "sickening white pepper flavour."
So I took equal amounts of white pepper, black pepper, msg, and half as much table salt, and mixed them in pestle and mortar. I took my jar of 2016 KFC mix and compared the two. Exactly the same. So, what is the response? How would you explain it, assuming my taste buds are accurate? How can white pepper have a sickening taste, and why would someone proclaim that? I remember several on the old TCK reflecting the same thoughts. Why?
If anyone presumes that todays' KFC is exactly the same, or is very close, then it must be just MSG, white pepper, black pepper and salt. I'm beginning to see all of the misinformation from people who really don't know S from S. Another chess fork.
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Post by deepfriednew101 on Jan 23, 2024 16:57:26 GMT 1
Tuxedo Pepper was a Mix of combination White and Black Pepper widely used in the 30's and 40's
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smallgree
Chef
Here is a vial recipe:
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Post by smallgree on Jan 29, 2024 5:34:39 GMT 1
A - Dried grated garlic B - Italian Seasoning C - Clove D - Tarragon E - Allspice F - Ginger G - Onion H - Celery I - Crushed brown mustard J - Bay leaf K - Peppercorns
I've done my best to show the progression of my experiments. I've posted my early recipes and my many guesses at the vials. And my theories and findings. I don't mess with recipes if I haven't cooked them, or if I cook them and they fail. I only show what I have pondered with the hope that someone else develops it better than I. I've posted somewhere (their are enough bouncers to have read them) my belief that the OR was developed by grinding, with pestle and mortar, various groupings of ingredients with msg and salt. Peppers, herbs (including vegetables), spices and Italian Seasoning. Meld separate, then together. I am showing my last guess at the vials. I have a few variations I will try, as I will explain.
There must be an ingredient that has so much nutty flavor, that other ingredients can be moved in or out of the recipe without greatly altering the recipe. The peppercorns, msg and salt are givens. This is the only way to explain that the various KFC versions throughout the years, and the various recipes Worldwide, can be different while retaining much of the note. Early testers thought they tasted an almond taste, and toasted sesame seeds are almond like. Chinese sesame chicken always had a pronounced taste, as did eating individual seeds off of a Quarter Pounder with cheese. Is it vial J? If J isn't mustard, then mustard has to be in Vials F or G (that is if you support mustard), and then garlic and onion are not in the Vials, which opens two vials. Is it an aromatic seed, in vial A, and mustard in vial F or G. Which aromatic seed? I need to check the growth of these seeds productions from the 50s on to the 90s. This is how I research. I have a recipe now using the Vial lineup above.
One other note. It is a bit silly to construct a single recipe for a single cook. I proportion my ingredients in a larger batch then measure out how much I need for two cups of flour. If your proportions are correct, then the msg will correctly match your herbs and spices proportionately. Salt is always standard for however much flour is used. I heard CHS say that the salt was added to the flour, then the seasoning was added.
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cman
Kitchen Assistent
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Post by cman on Jan 29, 2024 14:48:38 GMT 1
Smallgree, as some of us, like myself, have quests aside from this search for something lost through the ages, you are filling a burning curiosity with your diligent research. I’ve read through your musings in this forum and the other. Not sure if this forum can continue in its present state, so Thanks.
As for your search for the nuttiness in the mix, please consider the role of milk as it was always present in the early recipes and in the current mixes. Fried chicken has connections to southern fried chicken with buttermilk as an ingredient, there is always a soured milk aroma. I believe CHS included this in his recipe. Perhaps the addition of mustard enhances the nuttiness aroma and taste.
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smallgree
Chef
Here is a vial recipe:
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Post by smallgree on Jan 29, 2024 19:32:33 GMT 1
I do use both milk and mustard. It is true, that down here, buttermilk is a given, but I've seen no evidence that buttermilk was used. But as all Southerners know, add a little acid (vinegar, lemon juice) to milk, and you get buttermilk. I have heard CHS say that the milk and egg "warsh" was part of the OR taste.
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Post by Silver on Jan 29, 2024 19:46:06 GMT 1
I do use both milk and mustard. It is true, that down here, buttermilk is a given, but I've seen no evidence that buttermilk was used. But as all Southerners know, add a little acid (vinegar, lemon juice) to milk, and you get buttermilk. I have heard CHS say that the milk and egg "warsh" was part of the OR taste. smallgree, are you turning your milk used for the egg wash into homemade buttermilk? And is it yielding enhanced flavor results? Better coating adhesion?
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cman
Kitchen Assistent
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Post by cman on Jan 29, 2024 21:06:50 GMT 1
I do use both milk and mustard. It is true, that down here, buttermilk is a given, but I've seen no evidence that buttermilk was used. But as all Southerners know, add a little acid (vinegar, lemon juice) to milk, and you get buttermilk. I have heard CHS say that the milk and egg "warsh" was part of the OR taste. I also add lemon juice/vinegar to the milk so when the acid reacts to a baking powder in the flour, there is a chemical reaction that occurs releasing more aroma. Furthermore, some oil from the previous batch is added to the marinade, spices and wash to increase the potency of the aroma. I think it’s still in line with DFN101s’ observations with CHS.
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smallgree
Chef
Here is a vial recipe:
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Post by smallgree on Jan 29, 2024 22:49:27 GMT 1
I have used all types of techniques to bread the chicken. I don't use buttermilk with chicken because I've tried to stay kosher with what CHS information I know. But......... I do make buttermilk if I'm frying regular chicken, or making ranch dressing. I actually get the best breading and skin if I dry brine with salt and whatever, then mix dried skim milk with cornstarch then with a touch of milk, or water. I take this room temperature chicken and mix it well with this "paste" before I roll it into the flour. I do this because pastry flour has all but disappeared from the shelves. I've had difficulty with the skin and breading because I lost my pressure fryer. There are many roads that lead to Rome. I just have to find the correct one.
I must again proclaim that the chicken I buy has little to no flavor. I still believe that most of what we fight about, and the condition of KFC today, is because the chicken sucks. I don't believe that chicken powder is in the vials, but I am looking for some because something needs to be done to improve the crap I buy.
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