|
Post by Silver on Feb 18, 2022 20:53:35 GMT 1
And a recipe in the era of 3-5/8 Lbs. of Salt added to 25Lbs. of Flour might have looked something like this:
|
|
|
Post by Silver on Feb 18, 2022 21:23:22 GMT 1
To my taste buds the Salt can't fall below 3-5/8 Lb. into 25 Lbs. of Cake Flour, else your recipe will not make Chicken that equals the saltiness of KFC_OR. But that stated, many are of the belief that modern day KFC_OR has only 3.5 Lbs. of Salt being added into 25 Lbs. of Cake Flour.
The Dynamics for this 40 Ounce bag would potentially look like:
15 Ounces of MSG 8 Ounces of Salt 12 Ounces of combined B&W Pepper 5 Ounces of all remaining H&S ----------------------------------------- Sum Total = 40 Ounces in the bag (or 2.5 Lbs.), of which 1/2 Lb. is Salt
At this level of B&W Pepper there is no further need for any heat assistance from the likes of Cayenne or Crushed Red Chili Pepper Flakes, and this slot can be filled 1:1 by weight with things like Paprika or Chili Powder.
And likewise, this 40 Ounce bag will be added to 25 Lbs. of Flour and 3 Lbs. of Salt. Throughout all of KFC history this aspect of the process does not appear to have ever required change.
|
|
|
Post by Silver on Feb 18, 2022 21:30:09 GMT 1
And finally, presuming 3.5 Lbs. of Salt to be a truism, the last recipe of the 40 ounce bag era might have looked like this:
|
|
|
Post by Silver on Feb 18, 2022 21:43:34 GMT 1
And the first bag of the 32 Ounce bag era would potentially have reduced 15 Ounces of MSG to 6-7/8 Ounces, and added in 1/8 Ounce of 'I+G'. For a combined total of 7 Ounces of MSG plus I+G. With the rest of the recipe remaining the same.
15 - 7 = 8
40 - 8 = 32
|
|
|
Post by Silver on Feb 18, 2022 21:51:34 GMT 1
And lastly, with the introduction of the 26 Ounce bag, things like extracts, extratives, and oils seemingly rather likely begin to replace portions of the B&W Pepper plus portions of the 'other' H&S whereby to trim down 32 Ounces to 26 Ounces. With the disclaimer that all of this evolutionary reasoning as to bags is and has been merely my speculation.
For a reason that I can't quite place my finger upon, this seems to be a decent place to inject a quote which just popped into my mind, attributed to J.P. Morgan:
Perhaps needless to mention here, but the government and the press (etc...) were only ever fed the "good" reason.
|
|
|
Post by deepfriednew101 on Feb 19, 2022 0:15:06 GMT 1
Silver
great work
Just 1 note.
When a Vegetable item is listed and/or KFC has listed there Herb and spice the herbs and spices WOULD BE LISTED in a amount order then a a example if Garlic Celery Onion were all listed THEN the highest is Garlic celery second then last onion. BUT those 3 MAY OR MAY NOT be LOWER then the Herbs and Spices. the Herbs and spices if listed would be a separate weight category compared to the Vegetable.
in Many listing they also use Brackets ( Pepper, Paprika) Vegetable Garlic or Vegetable Onion.
|
|
flg
Souschef
Posts: 1,578
|
Post by flg on Feb 19, 2022 0:43:19 GMT 1
This week will be my FUN cook with 6g B+W pepper. I am going to top up the MSG to 8g and give this a roll. If it's not too much pepper than I'll stick by the formula I posted.
Once I have the boundary of the B+W Pepper. It sets for me the total allowable remainder H&S threshold. Which I believe including garlic powder would be 3g for our 200g flour basis.
|
|
|
Post by deepfriednew101 on Feb 19, 2022 7:38:59 GMT 1
I need to Help with the Understanding of the change of Spices in KFC NEW AGE CORPORATION.
I have researched this information going back to the 1905 Laws which were in place at the Time CHS made the 11 Spices and Herbs in 1939ish.
CHS and Claudia were under the 1905 FDA Act when they started packaging the 11 Spice and Herbs THIS is what CHS Termed it after it was being packaged BUT NOT PRIOR TO THE PACKAGING.
Prior to that time it was Spices and Seasoning. THIS IS VERY VERY important if you every go back and research WHY.
The 1905 FDA never listed many items UNDER the Term HERBS it was Very limited and were around ONLY 8 to 10 Items along the Time period. The original List was as simple as Basil Sweet, Bay Leaf, Marjoram, Rosemary Leaves, Sage, Thyme This info was provided from Old FDA material in the 1920.
The Spice and Seasoning List was Much More in-depth and lengthy. With approximately 20 to 30 along the time. Again it expanded from 1905 and increased with years. I concentrated on the 1905 to 1945 Time period for learning the Grand Father Clause under the Law which they informed.
The Original KFC was listed as Spice and Seasoning in the Patents of the Pressure Cooker CHS developed for Chicken. In the Time when you wrote for a Patent back in the 1950's 1960's YOU had to be specific. CHS listed the Cooking ingredient as FAT first and in 1960 FAT was Beef Fat or Beef Tallow. Lard was Pork, and Oils were Processed from Corns and other items.
Now the 1905 Act made more reference to SEASONING under which Mustards, and Vegetable Items Celery, Garlic, Onion and other Vegetable items WHICH did NOT have to be LISTED as even Allergens in the 1905-1950 time period.
The allergens were not a issue in many countries until the 1960's ( PLEASE UNDERSTAND OTHER COUNTRIES DIFFERED IN TIME PERIOD ) I Do not need a lesson in being correct or NOT with the TIME period of the EVENTS and my information is General and liberal with Years BUT the OVERALL information in correct.
Milk and Eggs were some of the First items which lead to Allergies listing, YES with other items BUT if you want some of the Starting item it was Milk and Egg Powders which were being developed as WAR ration. This is where INFORMATION started to develop with the Allergies.
Keep in Mind they did NOT list much on Processed items for Allergens and Ingredient's back then. Then as Time developed Salt and Calories Plus Fats became issue.
With the Salt many snuck around the Salt List requirements with MSG, and Celery Salt, Garlic Salt, Onion Salt. as they were listed as Vegetable seasoning and NOT SALT.
AGAIN CHS and then KFC NEW AGE CORPORATION were under the Grand Father Clause for the ORIGINAL KENTUCY FRIED CHICKEN SEASONING. ( KEY WORDS )
ONCE KFC NEW AGE CORPORATION started changing items NEW PROCESSED items like chicken Popcorn, chicken tenders, chicken burgers which were Processed AFTER the 1970's ( General Time Period ONLY ) they were FORCED to start listing items as they were NOT Grand Fathered.
ALSO understand CHS started a LAWSUIT against NEW AGE CORPORATION that they changed the ORIGINAL KENTUCY FRIED CHICKEN SEASONING. ( VERY IMPORTANT ) PLUS there was a Court Case which CHS had against FAMOUS RECIPES which Barred ANY AND ALL OTHER COMPANIES ( KEY INFORMATION )
CHS had KFC NEW AGE CORPORATION BY THE SHORT CURLIES as the Company had been sold to a NEW COMPANY. Hubbins Corporation was in a dilemma. THE CONTRACTS all pertained to the ORIGIANL KENTUCY FRIED CHICKEN SEASONING.
The 11 Herbs and Spice TITLE was Trade Marked by the NEW AGE CORPORATION BUT NOT THE recipe for the 11 Spices and Seasoning aka the ORIGINAL KENTUCY FRIED CHICKEN SEAOSNONING in the contracts.
I hope everyone is following the situation for NEW AGE KFC.
Plus in the 1965 era many spices and herbs were becoming short in supply and increased demands from PRE-Packaged Food that were SKY ROCKETING.
KFC had a major issue with Tellicherry Bland Pepper, shortage confirmed BY both KFC NEW AGE and Bill Summers Marion Kay.
so between the issues with shortages and Health concerns ETC plus the changes in Growing Spices and Herbs they started using the essential Oils first. Which then got renamed. to extracts. most of the first extracts were compounded in OIL.
extracts became compounded with oils also and were made into oils which then started to be MIXED with Starches and Salts sugars and Milk and Whey.
now extracts can be mixed with solid at a under 5% extract amount and NOT BE labeled with the Original name of Paprika, Sage, Pepper, ETC ETC or Vegetable items
they can be listed as Vegetable Proteins or Natural items if blend and ALL the Extract's can easily be mixed under the 5% amount. and if they need more then 5% then they mix the item as a example LIKE Paprika will be mixed with Starch as one item with 4%, and mixed with whey at 4% and they get 8% Paprika in 2 different items listed as corn starch and Whey product. the they also use 3% Paprika for coloring but total paprika is 11% under 3 items.
Milk Powder is listed Under Natural Flavoring in many countries and its LEGAL.
Chicken Seasoning is listen under Chicken Protein or Chicken Gelatin, or Natural Flavor.
SO if you think you can look at the ingredient list and figure out the Highest to Lowest item its very subjective. PLUS they can list the items also that are the SAME weight and you think its highest to lowest but in real they are all the SAME weight.
HOPE THIS HELPS with understanding of what came first the Chicken or the Egg, in the ingredient list.
|
|
|
Post by Silver on Feb 22, 2022 12:55:53 GMT 1
My latest 40 ounce compliant recipe leading up to cook session #13. With many of my past recipes I've been a stickler for uniformly spacing out the weight decline in a fixed lock step fashion for the various of Herbs and Spices. This recipe returns me to that fold while retaining the recent low mass line of reasoning for the H&S's, combined with a duplication of flg's recently boosted weights for white and black pepper.
|
|
|
Post by mackerbryanee13 on Feb 22, 2022 13:47:37 GMT 1
Hello! I've been patiently studying and learning your exchanges for over a year now and I also did a dozen chicken experiments to determine the secret 11. currently mixing herbs and spices now and sniffing it and also surfing the internet as well as diving into little mini details every step of the way. Forgive my grammar but I am impressed by the "Keep-Going-At-It" mentality of the many fry cooks here. I read so many articles and even food compounds that involves boring chemistry mathematics and went as far as ordering and requesting a new cooked batch of fried chicken from a KFC store just to taste the freshly made chicken and nail the note to my cerebral cortex, also spent considerable amount of time staring at the chicken and the numerous tiny black specks in it because it doesn't look like black pepper specks. It's something else. I see many sharp black specks and a few red specks What my guts have been telling me over and over is that "IT STANDS ON EVERYONE'S SHELF". Please give me a little bit of time finishing my current experiment. This 1 Common Ingredient that I have in mind could be the Secret. Peace!
|
|